[EVDL] EVLN: Musk walked-back on PV roof option> too heavy a car.

[paul dove via EV]

Who would feel safe in an 827 lb car?


On Sunday, December 9, 2018, 11:37:15 AM CST, Lawrence Rhodes via EV <***@lists.evdl.org> wrote:

I can only say that my attempts of education here have failed.  I will try again.  Elon is a devious and secretive person.  That is fine, he is in business and needs to protect himself. He is right, his wonderful but piggy cars are energy hogs.  At 5000 pounds he would have to tow a fairly large array to make the numbers work.  However he has something up his sleeve.  Every time I talk to my friends at Tesla about solar vehicles they shut up like clams. Tesla is well aware of the Cruiser Class(class rules mandate multiple passengers and a trunk.  That is a practical car) at the World Solar Challenge.  Tesla sponsors that class. Many higher ups at Tesla are solar team alums. They know what it takes and it isn't the current crop of Tesla design. Neither is it a rolling ping pong table.  Here is what works. A four wheel vehicle with: a weight of 850 pounds, CD of .016, a 15kw battery, 1.5kw solar array & seating for 4.  This design in the 2015 World Solar Challenge set a record over two days on one full charge of 931 miles. This design was so successful that the rules were changed in 2017 reducing the size of the solar array.  I hope now with this information everyone will realize that solar vehicles are indeed possible technically.  Can they be manufactured successfully?  I don't know.  However they exist. Three generations have been built by the students of Eindhoven University in the Nederland's and have won all three challenges in the Cruiser class started in 2013.  The Challenge is bi-annual. These vehicles can go 400 miles just on the battery.  With solar they are capable of 45mph just on the array.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stella_(solar_vehicles)https://www.google.com/search?q=three+generations+of+stella+solar+vehicles&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwixuczNoZPfAhXhgVQKHRQ3BBQQ_AUIDygC&biw=1579&bih=891So please don't be so happy to think solar vehicles are not possible.  Just not the way you want them to be.  These vehicles meet Dutch crash standards but they do use racing harnesses and have no air bags.  The 2017 Stella Vie is a 5 passenger vehicle.  Lawrence Rhodes







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[Lawrence Rhodes via EV]

You still don't get it.  This car is built like a race car and is a race car.  It is also touted as a family car.  The design is monocoque construction like formula 1.  Those cars survive 200 mph crashes.  A 5 point belt is part of the safety features. Lawrence Rhodes

Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android

On Sun, Dec 9, 2018 at 10:06 AM, paul dove<***@bellsouth.net> wrote: Who would feel safe in an 827 lb car?


On Sunday, December 9, 2018, 11:37:15 AM CST, Lawrence Rhodes via EV <***@lists.evdl.org> wrote:

I can only say that my attempts of education here have failed.  I will try again.  Elon is a devious and secretive person.  That is fine, he is in business and needs to protect himself. He is right, his wonderful but piggy cars are energy hogs.  At 5000 pounds he would have to tow a fairly large array to make the numbers work.  However he has something up his sleeve.  Every time I talk to my friends at Tesla about solar vehicles they shut up like clams. Tesla is well aware of the Cruiser Class(class rules mandate multiple passengers and a trunk.  That is a practical car) at the World Solar Challenge.  Tesla sponsors that class. Many higher ups at Tesla are solar team alums. They know what it takes and it isn't the current crop of Tesla design. Neither is it a rolling ping pong table.  Here is what works. A four wheel vehicle with: a weight of 850 pounds, CD of .016, a 15kw battery, 1.5kw solar array & seating for 4.  This design in the 2015 World Solar Challenge set a record over two days on one full charge of 931 miles. This design was so successful that the rules were changed in 2017 reducing the size of the solar array.  I hope now with this information everyone will realize that solar vehicles are indeed possible technically.  Can they be manufactured successfully?  I don't know.  However they exist. Three generations have been built by the students of Eindhoven University in the Nederland's and have won all three challenges in the Cruiser class started in 2013.  The Challenge is bi-annual. These vehicles can go 400 miles just on the battery.  With solar they are capable of 45mph just on the array.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stella_(solar_vehicles)https://www.google.com/search?q=three+generations+of+stella+solar+vehicles&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwixuczNoZPfAhXhgVQKHRQ3BBQQ_AUIDygC&biw=1579&bih=891So please don't be so happy to think solar vehicles are not possible.  Just not the way you want them to be.  These vehicles meet Dutch crash standards but they do use racing harnesses and have no air bags.  The 2017 Stella Vie is a 5 passenger vehicle.  Lawrence Rhodes







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[paul dove via EV]

I don’t think you get it! They wouldn’t sell many

Sent from my iPhone

You still don't get it. This car is built like a race car and is a race car. It is also touted as a family car. The design is monocoque construction like formula 1. Those cars survive 200 mph crashes. A 5 point belt is part of the safety features. Lawrence Rhodes
Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android
I can only say that my attempts of education here have failed. I will try again. Elon is a devious and secretive person. That is fine, he is in business and needs to protect himself. He is right, his wonderful but piggy cars are energy hogs. At 5000 pounds he would have to tow a fairly large array to make the numbers work. However he has something up his sleeve. Every time I talk to my friends at Tesla about solar vehicles they shut up like clams. Tesla is well aware of the Cruiser Class(class rules mandate multiple passengers and a trunk. That is a practical car) at the World Solar Challenge. Tesla sponsors that class. Many higher ups at Tesla are solar team alums. They know what it takes and it isn't the current crop of Tesla design. Neither is it a rolling ping pong table. Here is what works. A four wheel vehicle with: a weight of 850 pounds, CD of .016, a 15kw battery, 1.5kw solar array & seating for 4. This design in the 2015 World Solar Challenge set a record over two days on one full charge of 931 miles. This design was so successful that the rules were changed in 2017 reducing the size of the solar array. I hope now with this information everyone will realize that solar vehicles are indeed possible technically. Can they be manufactured successfully? I don't know. However they exist. Three generations have been built by the students of Eindhoven University in the Nederland's and have won all three challenges in the Cruiser class started in 2013. The Challenge is bi-annual. These vehicles can go 400 miles just on the battery. With solar they are capable of 45mph just on the array.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stella_(solar_vehicles)https://www.google.com/search?q=three+generations+of+stella+solar+vehicles&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwixuczNoZPfAhXhgVQKHRQ3BBQQ_AUIDygC&biw=1579&bih=891So please don't be so happy to think solar vehicles are not possible. Just not the way you want them to be. These vehicles meet Dutch crash standards but they do use racing harnesses and have no air bags. The 2017 Stella Vie is a 5 passenger vehicle. Lawrence Rhodes
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[Michael Ross via EV]

Well, I see it is a solar racing car with room for a family. It is not a
racing car. It is large, it is expensive at least as a prototype ("costs
like a house" the DUtch guy saya.) It goes 500 mile on a charge - on a
sunny day. You can get regullar cummting out of it in Holland where it is
rainy a lot. But that is not even close to 500 miles.

I still like it a lot, but its not ready for prime time. It is a nice
demonstration.

I have a small car by choice, and used to commute on an Organic Transit
ELF. It would reduce my 25 mile commute to 1 hour and get me a lit of nice
exercise. Its less than one meter square of panel was useless except as a
marketing ploy. I like small vehicles so a solar car is out of my solution
set. I would not want a car with that much acreage attached to it. I would
rather have panels at home and batteries inside the car.

You still don't get it. This car is built like a race car and is a race
car. It is also touted as a family car. The design is monocoque
construction like formula 1. Those cars survive 200 mph crashes. A 5
point belt is part of the safety features. Lawrence Rhodes
Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android
wrote: Who would feel safe in an 827 lb car?
On Sunday, December 9, 2018, 11:37:15 AM CST, Lawrence Rhodes via EV <
I can only say that my attempts of education here have failed. I will
try again. Elon is a devious and secretive person. That is fine, he is in
business and needs to protect himself. He is right, his wonderful but piggy
cars are energy hogs. At 5000 pounds he would have to tow a fairly large
array to make the numbers work. However he has something up his sleeve.
Every time I talk to my friends at Tesla about solar vehicles they shut up
like clams. Tesla is well aware of the Cruiser Class(class rules mandate
multiple passengers and a trunk. That is a practical car) at the World
Solar Challenge. Tesla sponsors that class. Many higher ups at Tesla are
solar team alums. They know what it takes and it isn't the current crop of
Tesla design. Neither is it a rolling ping pong table. Here is what works.
A four wheel vehicle with: a weight of 850 pounds, CD of .016, a 15kw
battery, 1.5kw solar array & seating for 4. This design in the 2015 World
Solar Challenge set a record over two days on one full charge of 931 miles.
This design was so successful that the rules were changed in 2017 reducing
the size of the solar array. I hope now with this information everyone
will realize that solar vehicles are indeed possible technically. Can they
be manufactured successfully? I don't know. However they exist. Three
generations have been built by the students of Eindhoven University in the
Nederland's and have won all three challenges in the Cruiser class started
in 2013. The Challenge is bi-annual. These vehicles can go 400 miles just
on the battery. With solar they are capable of 45mph just on the array.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stella_(solar_vehicles)https://www.google.com/search?q=three+generations+of+stella+solar+vehicles&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwixuczNoZPfAhXhgVQKHRQ3BBQQ_AUIDygC&biw=1579&bih=891So
please don't be so happy to think solar vehicles are not possible. Just
not the way you want them to be. These vehicles meet Dutch crash standards
but they do use racing harnesses and have no air bags. The 2017 Stella Vie
is a 5 passenger vehicle. Lawrence Rhodes
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--
Michael E. Ross
[phone] Land
[phone] Cell and Text
[phone] <https://www.google.com/voice/b/0?pli=1#phones> Tablet,
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[Lawrence Rhodes via EV]

As I remember a Tesla S is about the same foot print.  L R
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[John Lussmyer via EV]

Post by Lawrence Rhodes via EV
You still don't get it.  This car is built like a race car and is a race car.  It is also touted as a family car.  The design is monocoque construction like formula 1.  Those cars survive 200 mph crashes.  A 5 point belt is part of the safety features. Lawrence Rhodes

I've never seen anyone tell me about the Stella's interior - in a way that a normal car owner would be interested in.
If it doesn't have heat and air conditioning, it's not a useful vehicle for a huge % of the population.
Things like seat comfort, radio, road noise, etc.. are also important.


--

Worlds only All Electric F-250 truck! http://john.casadelgato.com/Electric-Vehicles/1995-Ford-F-250

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[Michael Ross via EV]

Lawrence,

I don't think you need to tar Musk like that. He is simply practical -
thinking that cars that appeal to the vast majority of drivers and
passengers will be loaded with services and comfort, they will be very well
appointed, compared to things like a Stella, will thus be heavy, will be
very good protection in case of an accident. That sort of car simply cannot
be powered with the mere upward pointing area it will have.

Stella and such are cool projects, but I don't want to give up a cushy
seat, conditioned surroundings, a great stereo, lots of cargo capacity,
won't flip over in a high crosswind, parks in a small space and is easily
maneuvered, doesn't have to be located in the sun for any length of time,
and not having to think about maintaining it in any particular way other
than plugging it in.

I get it you don't like this situation, but it isn't going to change.
However, Musk has done great work creating the advent of a much cleaner
form of transportation- probably with global positive effects. If the fuel
supply can be cleaned up and mass transit imported and electrified we will
be far better off than had he done nothing.

I can only say that my attempts of education here have failed. I will try
again. Elon is a devious and secretive person. That is fine, he is in
business and needs to protect himself. He is right, his wonderful but piggy
cars are energy hogs. At 5000 pounds he would have to tow a fairly large
array to make the numbers work. However he has something up his sleeve.
Every time I talk to my friends at Tesla about solar vehicles they shut up
like clams. Tesla is well aware of the Cruiser Class(class rules mandate
multiple passengers and a trunk. That is a practical car) at the World
Solar Challenge. Tesla sponsors that class. Many higher ups at Tesla are
solar team alums. They know what it takes and it isn't the current crop of
Tesla design. Neither is it a rolling ping pong table. Here is what works.
A four wheel vehicle with: a weight of 850 pounds, CD of .016, a 15kw
battery, 1.5kw solar array & seating for 4. This design in the 2015 World
Solar Challenge set a record over two days on one full charge of 931 miles.
This design was so successful that the rules were changed in 2017 reducing
the size of the solar array. I hope now with this information everyone
will realize that solar vehicles are indeed possible technically. Can they
be manufactured successfully? I don't know. However they exist. Three
generations have been built by the students of Eindhoven University in the
Nederland's and have won all three challenges in the Cruiser class started
in 2013. The Challenge is bi-annual. These vehicles can go 400 miles just
on the battery. With solar they are capable of 45mph just on the array.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stella_(solar_vehicles)https://www.google.com/search?q=three+generations+of+stella+solar+vehicles&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwixuczNoZPfAhXhgVQKHRQ3BBQQ_AUIDygC&biw=1579&bih=891So
please don't be so happy to think solar vehicles are not possible. Just
not the way you want them to be. These vehicles meet Dutch crash standards
but they do use racing harnesses and have no air bags. The 2017 Stella Vie
is a 5 passenger vehicle. Lawrence Rhodes
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--
Michael E. Ross
[phone] Land
[phone] Cell and Text
[phone] <https://www.google.com/voice/b/0?pli=1#phones> Tablet,
Google Phone and Text
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